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Post by astropoug on Apr 7, 2022 9:33:56 GMT 10
Thinking about it some more, here are the years that I say encompass the classic and modern 90s
Classic 90s: 1991-1995
Modern 90s: 1996-2000
As bestmvp said, 1990 is way too 80s to even be classic 90s, since the SNES wasn't out yet, the Genesis wasn't popular yet, the NES was still the king of gaming, home computers like the Amiga were still popular, hair metal was popular, the Soviet Union was still around, and Nicktoons weren't a thing yet. 1991 does have some 80s aspects to it such as the NES still being popular and hair metal still having some hits, but otherwise A LOT changed that by the end of the year, you could truly say we were firmly in the 90s. I think 1992 to 1994 are the quintessential classic 90s years. This is the era of grunge, the peak of the Disney Renaissance, Sonic the Hedgehog in its prime, the 16-bit console wars, and most people not knowing what the internet was. 1995 is where things start to shift especially with the release of Toy Story, Windows 95, and 5th gen consoles like the Sega Saturn and PlayStation, not to mention grunge music declining in spite of the aesthetic and vibe still being popular. I think 1996 with the release of the N64, cheesy songs like Macarena, and new game franchises like Tomb Raider and Crash Bandicoot is where the modern 90s starts. 1997 and 1998 are the quintessential modern 90s years, and 1999 still is, but has early 2000s influence. The modern 90s are defined by 5th gen video games, Windows 9x, GeoCities, teen pop, and the dot-com bubble.
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Post by slashpop on Apr 7, 2022 9:36:30 GMT 10
Classic 90s:
1990-1991 to Summer 1996
Transition: Fall 1996 to Summer 1997
Modern 90s:
Fall 1997 to Summer 1999
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Post by John Titor on Apr 7, 2022 11:30:19 GMT 10
I agree anything pas fall 97 is modern 90s
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Post by astropoug on Apr 7, 2022 11:33:11 GMT 10
I agree anything pas fall 97 is modern 90s I think the entire year was modern 90s. 1996 IMO is modern 90s but still has classic 90s influence. I still personally see 1995 as the last classic 90s year.
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Post by John Titor on Apr 7, 2022 11:36:47 GMT 10
I agree anything pas fall 97 is modern 90s I think the entire year was modern 90s. 1996 IMO is modern 90s but still has classic 90s influence. I still personally see 1995 as the last classic 90s year. once we get into Summer 97 it was all systems go
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Post by John Titor on Apr 7, 2022 11:42:49 GMT 10
Like around July
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Post by bestmvp29 on Apr 7, 2022 13:14:32 GMT 10
Thinking about it some more, here are the years that I say encompass the classic and modern 90s Classic 90s: 1991-1995 Modern 90s: 1996-2000 As bestmvp said, 1990 is way too 80s to even be classic 90s, since the SNES wasn't out yet, the Genesis wasn't popular yet, the NES was still the king of gaming, home computers like the Amiga were still popular, hair metal was popular, the Soviet Union was still around, and Nicktoons weren't a thing yet. 1991 does have some 80s aspects to it such as the NES still being popular and hair metal still having some hits, but otherwise A LOT changed that by the end of the year, you could truly say we were firmly in the 90s. I think 1992 to 1994 are the quintessential classic 90s years. This is the era of grunge, the peak of the Disney Renaissance, Sonic the Hedgehog in its prime, the 16-bit console wars, and most people not knowing what the internet was. 1995 is where things start to shift especially with the release of Toy Story, Windows 95, and 5th gen consoles like the Sega Saturn and PlayStation, not to mention grunge music declining in spite of the aesthetic and vibe still being popular. I think 1996 with the release of the N64, cheesy songs like Macarena, and new game franchises like Tomb Raider and Crash Bandicoot is where the modern 90s starts. 1997 and 1998 are the quintessential modern 90s years, and 1999 still is, but has early 2000s influence. The modern 90s are defined by 5th gen video games, Windows 9x, GeoCities, teen pop, and the dot-com bubble. This is the best take I've seen. 1990 is easily modern 80s. 1991 I guess could be the transition year but overall is classic 90s, especially by the second half. 1992 to 1994 is definitely the indisputable classic 90's years. 1995 was the beginning of the transition due to all the things you said. I'm starting to think the first half could be safely classic 90s as well, but the summer of 1995 would be the start of the transition. 1996 is that real 50/50 year where it could easily be modern 90s but a lot of the things that the classic 90s were known for were strong that year. 1997 is where the modern 90s truly starts but after seeing some other comments, I guess the first half up until the summer could be transitional but fall 1997 is absolutely modern 90s. Transition from modern 80s to classic 90s: Fall 1990 to Fall 1991 (starts in Fall 1990 because of the start of the Fresh Prince of Bel Air. I included Fall 1991 since the USSR was still around. Fall 1989 could debatably work as well due to the Fall of the Berlin Wall and the start of shows like Seinfeld and Family Matters too but I still think all of 1989 and most of 1990 safely belongs in modern 90s but you dispute me with that) Quintessential classic 90s: Winter 1991/2 to Spring 1995 Transition from classic 90s to modern 90s: Summer 1995 to Winter/Spring 1997 (sometime around early 1997 is where the modern 90's was in full effect) Quintessential modern 90s: Spring 1997 to Winter/Spring 1999 (sometime around early 1999 I guess is where the 2000's starts to come in, although I could stretch it to Fall 1999 right before Y2K) Transition from modern 90s to classic 00s: Winter 2000 to Winter 2001 This is a rough estimate and some people might disagree with some of the dates, for example, one might not see 1992 as quintessential classic 90's because of Bush or whatever, but I think this is pretty accurate overall.
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Post by astropoug on Apr 7, 2022 13:23:10 GMT 10
Thinking about it some more, here are the years that I say encompass the classic and modern 90s Classic 90s: 1991-1995 Modern 90s: 1996-2000 As bestmvp said, 1990 is way too 80s to even be classic 90s, since the SNES wasn't out yet, the Genesis wasn't popular yet, the NES was still the king of gaming, home computers like the Amiga were still popular, hair metal was popular, the Soviet Union was still around, and Nicktoons weren't a thing yet. 1991 does have some 80s aspects to it such as the NES still being popular and hair metal still having some hits, but otherwise A LOT changed that by the end of the year, you could truly say we were firmly in the 90s. I think 1992 to 1994 are the quintessential classic 90s years. This is the era of grunge, the peak of the Disney Renaissance, Sonic the Hedgehog in its prime, the 16-bit console wars, and most people not knowing what the internet was. 1995 is where things start to shift especially with the release of Toy Story, Windows 95, and 5th gen consoles like the Sega Saturn and PlayStation, not to mention grunge music declining in spite of the aesthetic and vibe still being popular. I think 1996 with the release of the N64, cheesy songs like Macarena, and new game franchises like Tomb Raider and Crash Bandicoot is where the modern 90s starts. 1997 and 1998 are the quintessential modern 90s years, and 1999 still is, but has early 2000s influence. The modern 90s are defined by 5th gen video games, Windows 9x, GeoCities, teen pop, and the dot-com bubble. This is the best take I've seen. 1990 is easily modern 80s. 1991 I guess could be the transition year but overall is classic 90s, especially by the second half. 1992 to 1994 is definitely the indisputable classic 90's years. 1995 was the beginning of the transition due to all the things you said. I'm starting to think the first half could be safely classic 90s as well, but the summer of 1995 would be the start of the transition. 1996 is that real 50/50 year where it could easily be modern 90s but a lot of the things that the classic 90s were known for were strong that year. 1997 is where the modern 90s truly starts but after seeing some other comments, I guess the first half up until the summer could be transitional but fall 1997 is absolutely modern 90s. Transition from modern 80s to classic 90s: Fall 1990 to Fall 1991 (starts in Fall 1990 because of the start of the Fresh Prince of Bel Air. I included Fall 1991 since the USSR was still around. Fall 1989 could debatably work as well due to the Fall of the Berlin Wall and the start of shows like Seinfeld and Family Matters too but I still think all of 1989 and most of 1990 safely belongs in modern 90s but you dispute me with that) Quintessential classic 90s: Winter 1991/2 to Spring 1995 Transition from classic 90s to modern 90s: Summer 1995 to Winter/Spring 1997 (sometime around early 1997 is where the modern 90's was in full effect) Quintessential modern 90s: Spring 1997 to Winter/Spring 1999 (sometime around early 1999 I guess is where the 2000's starts to come in, although I could stretch it to Fall 1999 right before Y2K) Transition from modern 90s to classic 00s: Spring 1999 to Summer 2001 (mostly because of the obvious) This is a rough estimate and some people might disagree with some of the dates, for example, one might not see 1992 as quintessential classic 90's because of Bush or whatever, but I think this is pretty accurate overall. Bush Sr might’ve still been president in 1992, but culture has gotten far more liberal around 1991/1992, especially after the Rodney King riots. And plus, the end of the Cold War really ended Reagan era politics in my opinion. Depending on how you see the 90s, you could argue that 1991 is still too undeveloped to truly be 90s, and that by 2000, most core 90s culture had died off or became unpopular, with rapidly developing 00s influences, making that year sort of in a weird limbo where it’s not quite modern 90s or classic 2000s. 2001 is indisputably classic 2000s though, especially with 9/11. Likewise, 1989-1991 could exist in a weird limbo period that’s not quite 80s or 90s, what Infinity on Inthe00s referred to as the “neighties”. So this would make 1992-1995 the classic Gen X 90s and 1996-1999 the millennial 90s. By this definition, this is now how the 90s are divided Classic 90s: 1992-1995 Modern 90s: 1996-1999
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Post by bestmvp29 on Apr 7, 2022 13:32:45 GMT 10
This is the best take I've seen. 1990 is easily modern 80s. 1991 I guess could be the transition year but overall is classic 90s, especially by the second half. 1992 to 1994 is definitely the indisputable classic 90's years. 1995 was the beginning of the transition due to all the things you said. I'm starting to think the first half could be safely classic 90s as well, but the summer of 1995 would be the start of the transition. 1996 is that real 50/50 year where it could easily be modern 90s but a lot of the things that the classic 90s were known for were strong that year. 1997 is where the modern 90s truly starts but after seeing some other comments, I guess the first half up until the summer could be transitional but fall 1997 is absolutely modern 90s. Transition from modern 80s to classic 90s: Fall 1990 to Fall 1991 (starts in Fall 1990 because of the start of the Fresh Prince of Bel Air. I included Fall 1991 since the USSR was still around. Fall 1989 could debatably work as well due to the Fall of the Berlin Wall and the start of shows like Seinfeld and Family Matters too but I still think all of 1989 and most of 1990 safely belongs in modern 90s but you dispute me with that) Quintessential classic 90s: Winter 1991/2 to Spring 1995 Transition from classic 90s to modern 90s: Summer 1995 to Winter/Spring 1997 (sometime around early 1997 is where the modern 90's was in full effect) Quintessential modern 90s: Spring 1997 to Winter/Spring 1999 (sometime around early 1999 I guess is where the 2000's starts to come in, although I could stretch it to Fall 1999 right before Y2K) Transition from modern 90s to classic 00s: Spring 1999 to Summer 2001 (mostly because of the obvious) This is a rough estimate and some people might disagree with some of the dates, for example, one might not see 1992 as quintessential classic 90's because of Bush or whatever, but I think this is pretty accurate overall. Bush Sr might’ve still been president in 1992, but culture has gotten far more liberal around 1991/1992, especially after the Rodney King riots. And plus, the end of the Cold War really ended Reagan era politics in my opinion. Depending on how you see the 90s, you could argue that 1991 is still too undeveloped to truly be 90s, and that by 2000, most core 90s culture had died off or became unpopular, with rapidly developing 00s influences, making that year sort of in a weird limbo where it’s not quite modern 90s or classic 2000s. 2001 is indisputably classic 2000s though, especially with 9/11. Likewise, 1989-1991 could exist in a weird limbo period that’s not quite 80s or 90s, what Infinity on Inthe00s referred to as the “neighties”. So this would make 1992-1995 the classic Gen X 90s and 1996-1999 the millennial 90s. By this definition, this is now how the 90s are divided Classic 90s: 1992-1995 Modern 90s: 1996-1999 True. I might actually change the transition to like winter 2000 to winter 2001. I'll give early 2001 the edge at least. Spring 2001 onward could be seen as regular classic 00's. 1992-1995 as the Gen X 90s makes sense since this is the era of the 90s that Gen Xers look back on with pride while they look down upon the 1996-1999 era that Millennials love. I still think 1996 is classic 90s overall, but maybe we could come to a compromise here. Up until spring 1996 can still be classified as classic 90's. Summer 1996 is the shift. Fall 1996 onward is modern 90's.
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Post by astropoug on Apr 8, 2022 17:20:22 GMT 10
One interesting thing I’ve noticed is that, whilst animation on cable TV first became a thing in the 90s, it seemed the classic 90s was the last era where Saturday morning blocks on broadcast TV was the most popular way people watched animation. Modern 90s is where it truly shifts to cable networks like Nick and Cartoon Network, specifically around 1996/1997.
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Post by John Titor on Apr 9, 2022 1:15:17 GMT 10
One interesting thing I’ve noticed is that, whilst animation on cable TV first became a thing in the 90s, it seemed the classic 90s was the last era where Saturday morning blocks on broadcast TV was the most popular way people watched animation. Modern 90s is where it truly shifts to cable networks like Nick and Cartoon Network, specifically around 1996/1997. I can tell you when this started to change, when Fox Kids started losing steam in 2000 almost 80% of the attention went to Cartoon Network to the point where The WB created Toonami 2 block to air on the network at the same time as the CN one. In 96/97 Fox Kids, The WB (Kids WB) as well as ABC still had a dominance on the ratings, a few more years and it would be over, Pokemon moving to the WB in early 99 did a ton of damage to the other competing broadcast networks at the time as well.
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Post by astropoug on Apr 9, 2022 1:47:21 GMT 10
One interesting thing I’ve noticed is that, whilst animation on cable TV first became a thing in the 90s, it seemed the classic 90s was the last era where Saturday morning blocks on broadcast TV was the most popular way people watched animation. Modern 90s is where it truly shifts to cable networks like Nick and Cartoon Network, specifically around 1996/1997. I can tell you when this started to change, when Fox Kids started losing steam in 2000 almost 80% of the attention went to Cartoon Network to the point where The WB created Toonami 2 block to air on the network at the same time as the CN one. In 96/97 Fox Kids, The WB (Kids WB) as well as ABC still had a dominance on the ratings, a few more years and it would be over, Pokemon moving to the WB in early 99 did a ton of damage to the other competing broadcast networks at the time as well. This is true. You could also say the end of Poke-Mania in 2001 also contributed, since that was Kids WB’s biggest draw. That same year, shows like SpongeBob became big. Disney’s One Saturday Morning shut down, and began shifting their focus toward Disney Channel, with Lizzie McGuire and The Proud Family premiering that year. Whilst you still had shows like Yu-Gi-Oh, as well as the infamous 4Kids block bringing some attention, by and large, things had shifted by 2001. Of course, this isn’t the shift from classic/modern 90s so much as it is the shift from 90s kid culture to 00s kid culture. Even still, now that you bring up the WB, this IS a shift from the classic 90s to the modern 90s, since it launched in 1995. During the modern 90s, Kids WB competed with Fox Kids, as well as Nickelodeon and Cartoon Network for viewership.
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Post by John Titor on Apr 9, 2022 2:20:52 GMT 10
I can tell you when this started to change, when Fox Kids started losing steam in 2000 almost 80% of the attention went to Cartoon Network to the point where The WB created Toonami 2 block to air on the network at the same time as the CN one. In 96/97 Fox Kids, The WB (Kids WB) as well as ABC still had a dominance on the ratings, a few more years and it would be over, Pokemon moving to the WB in early 99 did a ton of damage to the other competing broadcast networks at the time as well. This is true. You could also say the end of Poke-Mania in 2001 also contributed, since that was Kids WB’s biggest draw. That same year, shows like SpongeBob became big. Disney’s One Saturday Morning shut down, and began shifting their focus toward Disney Channel, with Lizzie McGuire and The Proud Family premiering that year. Whilst you still had shows like Yu-Gi-Oh, as well as the infamous 4Kids block bringing some attention, by and large, things had shifted by 2001. Of course, this isn’t the shift from classic/modern 90s so much as it is the shift from 90s kid culture to 00s kid culture. Even still, now that you bring up the WB, this IS a shift from the classic 90s to the modern 90s, since it launched in 1995. During the modern 90s, Kids WB competed with Fox Kids, as well as Nickelodeon and Cartoon Network for viewership. I can give you a pretty accurate timeline of the rankings of the blocks year by year from 94 on, as I saw it ( Nielsen ratings wise) it's interesting what happened 1994) 1 - Fox Kids 2) Abc 3) Nick 4) CBS Action Zone 1995) 1) Fox Kids 2) Abc 3) Nick 4) Kids WB ! 1996) 1) Fox Kids 2) Nick 3) Kids WB! 4) Abc 1997) 1) Fox Kids 2) Nick 3) Kids WB! 4) Abc Disney One Saturday morning 1998 ) 1) Abc disney One Saturday morning 2) Fox Kids 3) Kids WB! 4) Cartoon Network 1999) 1) Kids WB! 2) Nick 3) Fox Kids 4) Cartoon Network 2000 ) 1) Cartoon Network 2) Kids WB ! 3) Nick 4) Fox Kids 2001 ) 1) Cartoon Network 2) Kids WB! 3) Nick 4) Disney channel 2002 ) 1) Cartoon Network 2) Nick 3) Disney Channel 4) Abc Family 2003) 1) Cartoon Network 2) Nick 3) Disney Channel 4) Abc Family 2004) 1) Cartoon Network 2) Nick 3) JETIX on Abc Family 4) Disney Channel As you can see by the data as soon as Pokemon jumped ship from syndication to The WB network in early 99 it became the #1 network for Saturday morning cartoons, Fox Kids held their own and was the number 1 spot until late 1998, they were lucky to have Power Rangers in Space and Power Rangers Lost Galaxy as Mega ratings hits in the first month, but it was not enough to take on Pokemania. The majority of Fox's ratings in the mid 90s was Power Rangers, X-Men and Batman the Animated Series, which in 96 lost DC content to The WB network.
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Post by astropoug on Apr 9, 2022 2:42:56 GMT 10
This is true. You could also say the end of Poke-Mania in 2001 also contributed, since that was Kids WB’s biggest draw. That same year, shows like SpongeBob became big. Disney’s One Saturday Morning shut down, and began shifting their focus toward Disney Channel, with Lizzie McGuire and The Proud Family premiering that year. Whilst you still had shows like Yu-Gi-Oh, as well as the infamous 4Kids block bringing some attention, by and large, things had shifted by 2001. Of course, this isn’t the shift from classic/modern 90s so much as it is the shift from 90s kid culture to 00s kid culture. Even still, now that you bring up the WB, this IS a shift from the classic 90s to the modern 90s, since it launched in 1995. During the modern 90s, Kids WB competed with Fox Kids, as well as Nickelodeon and Cartoon Network for viewership. I can give you a pretty accurate timeline of the rankings of the blocks year by year from 94 on, as I saw it ( Nielsen ratings wise) it's interesting what happened 1994) 1 - Fox Kids 2) Abc 3) Nick 4) CBS Action Zone 1995) 1) Fox Kids 2) Abc 3) Nick 4) Kids WB ! 1996) 1) Fox Kids 2) Nick 3) Kids WB! 4) Abc 1997) 1) Fox Kids 2) Nick 3) Kids WB! 4) Abc Disney One Saturday morning 1998 ) 1) Abc disney One Saturday morning 2) Fox Kids 3) Kids WB! 4) Cartoon Network 1999) 1) Kids WB! 2) Nick 3) Fox Kids 4) Cartoon Network 2000 ) 1) Cartoon Network 2) Kids WB ! 3) Nick 4) Fox Kids 2001 ) 1) Cartoon Network 2) Kids WB! 3) Nick 4) Disney channel 2002 ) 1) Cartoon Network 2) Nick 3) Disney Channel 4) Abc Family 2003) 1) Cartoon Network 2) Nick 3) Disney Channel 4) Abc Family 2004) 1) Cartoon Network 2) Nick 3) JETIX on Abc Family 4) Disney Channel As you can see by the data as soon as Pokemon jumped ship from syndication to The WB network in early 99 it became the #1 network for Saturday morning cartoons, Fox Kids held their own and was the number 1 spot until late 1998, they were lucky to have Power Rangers in Space and Power Rangers Lost Galaxy as Mega ratings hits in the first month, but it was not enough to take on Pokemania. The majority of Fox's ratings in the mid 90s was Power Rangers, X-Men and Batman the Animated Series, which in 96 lost DC content to The WB network. This pretty much confirms my belief that 2002 was when the core 2000s began. On a side note, do you know the EXACT year that Nick, CN, and Disney peaked in the Nielsen ratings?
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